Burnley Grammar School

Childhood > Schools

6991 Comments

Burnley Grammar School
Burnley Grammar School
Year: 1959
Views: 1,596,510
Item #: 1607
There's pleny of room in the modern-styled gymnasium for muscle developing, where the boys are supervised by Mr. R. Parry, the physical education instruction.
Source: Lancashire Life Magazine, December 1959

Comment by: Steve on 24th September 2024 at 21:40

In response to Mickey’s question belly buttons were not something we ever took notice of either whilst doing shirtless PE or during swimming lessons. I cannot recall anyone ever commenting on someone’s belly button.

IP Logged: **.***.184.47

Comment by: Mickey on 23rd September 2024 at 22:46

It's only tangentially related to some conversations here, but would anyone object to me returning to the topic of belly buttons?

Specifically, if you did topless sport at school would another lad having an outie be something you might notice? Or even comment on?

IP Logged: **.***.227.180

Comment by: Alan on 24th August 2024 at 09:42

Comment by: Mr Dando on 23rd August 2024 at 18:27

Phillipson is completely ineffectual, in that, like all her colleagues, she has no "plan", except to uphold the status quo, which is what the toolmakers son wants - anyone stepping out of line in his cabinet will find themselves on the back benches.

I think MOST schools allow boys to wear tops these days - and as I have said very often in these pages, if a lad chooses so to do, he should be allowed to, in the same way as if a boy wishes to remove his top that is allowable too. I think that this courtesy should be extended to ALL schools regardless of status, however much it upsets the Colonel Blimps, who still patrol the locker rooms with their dreams of National Service and retirement.

The shower situation is more problematic. I preferred to shower, as I didn't like feeling stale all day, but in an ideal world, there would be individual shower cubicles - given the state of the national finances, this won;t happen, but teachers should definitely not be allowed to watch the act of showering.

I honestly don't think this government will change anything, and it remains to see if Starmer can stagger through five years

IP Logged: ***.**.3.141

Comment by: Mr Dando on 23rd August 2024 at 18:27

Case noted Alan there is no point Labour introducing a crime of "extreme misogyny" unless it is prepared to end extreme Mysandry against male pupils.

There is also no reason for a Ministry for women unless you are going to have a Ministry for men.

https://www.castlehill.stockport.sch.uk/Information/Uniforms/

The following are required for PE:

T-shirt, shorts or jogging bottoms & trainers (any colour)
PE classes take place both indoors and outdoors and therefore students should bring clothing as appropriate for weather conditions. Students are required to shower after PE and should bring a towel. On Wednesdays, at certain times of the year, Year 7 students will need to bring a swimming kit for swimming lessons.

Bridget Phillipson I give you until 1 September 2024 to end School showers and topless swimming for all male pupils.

If Labour fails the working class over the next 5 years they will end up like the tories and cast into electoral oblivion.

Reported Muhammad Jahsh, "The Messenger of Allah, upon whom be peace, passed by Ma'mar while his thighs were uncovered. He said, to him, 'O Ma'mar, cover your thighs, for they are (part of the) 'aurah." This is related by Ahmad, al-Hakim and al-Bukhari in Tareekh and in mu'allaq form in his Sahih.

IP Logged: *.**.171.185

Comment by: Alan on 22nd August 2024 at 12:48

Comment by: Mr Dando on 21st August 2024 at 18:28


While I agree with you about the brutality that seemed to pertain grammar schools in the past (I know little of what goes on in the remaining few), I can't agree with you about the warning letter sent to parents that Woodgate sent. I know nothing about this establishment, any more than any other, they are at least given the opportunity of allowing their pupils the chance to avoid the changing room, if they are shy or nervous. The only thing I found odd in their letter is that some of the gear the children are wearing is "too revealing". Without wishing to be crude what can a primary age child possibly "reveal"?.

All the schools you cite seem to allow all male pupils to wear shirts. The shower situation is one that is problematic. I preferred to feel clean for the rest of the day, so I used them, though I very much resented that our teacher was allowed to stand and watch us.

I think you are being very optimistic if you think the current Labour party is going to be very much different to any other government - Starmer is very much the establishment man ("Mr. Rules" as he once described himself), and is clearly very autocratic. It might be argued that he is the best leader the Conservatives never had. Beyond dragging us all into bankruptcy due to the mad "net zero" policy (which they will never fulfill by 2030, and probably won't be able to do for years) - also given the fact the U.K. is responsible for only 1% of the world total of emissions, I doubt this government will change anything much (unless you are a train driver or NHS employee). The current Education Minister seems more interested in promoting left wing ideology around feminism than anything else.

IP Logged: ***.**.3.191

Comment by: Mr Dando on 21st August 2024 at 18:28

It is truly terrfiying to hear the brutality that is meted out in School boarding schools. There is no place for bare chested PE in a civilised society and we must ensure that all schools ban compulsory showers and eliminate nudity in both pùblic and private schools.

Now we have a change of Government we must makre sure that Keir Starmer keeps to his plan of introducing 20% VAT for all private schools so that we can end White male privilege and make sure communal showers in boarding schools are consigned to the dustbin of history.

It is sad to hear of anybody being intimidated from using this public forum but just as it was wrong in the 1980s to defend corporal punishment so in the 2020´s it is wrong to support compulsory showers and dividing school boys into "Shirts versus Skins".

We must use this new Labour Government to bring forward a progressive revolution so that Transgender and Muslim pupils are fully protected.
No Longer should boys have to wear compulsory football boots when it is not required of girls. No Longer should boys have to wear ties when it is nor mandated for girls.

No longer should boys be denied Tracksuit bottoms, Leggings and one piece swimming suits when it is allowed for girls.

We must end the barbaric practice of schools forcing to pupils to change in communal rooms and maintain the post covid policy of allowing students to come to schools in a modest PE kit.

https://www.woodgateprimary.co.uk/news/detail/important-information-about-pe-kits/ "Please support us and make sure that your child has the correct P.E. kit or comes to school in their normal uniform every day and gets changed before the P.E. lesson.

"If children continue to come into school in inappropriate clothing for P.E. we will stop the system and go back to all children having to change in school before the lesson. "

Colleagues this is not acceptable and I just want a better world for all school children without discrimination on the grounds of gender, transgender, religious belief or political creed.

If you doubt my sincerity please take a look at this school which discriminates on the grounds of sex.

https://www.frederickbird.coventry.sch.uk/parents/school-uniform/sports-kit/

GIRLS SWIMMING KIT

One piece swimming costume
In addition, if necessary, girls can wear tight fitting footless tights underneath the swimming costume.
Girls’ swimming costumes should not have a skirt attached as this restricts movement and makes learning to swim much more difficult.
Headscarves should not be worn, however should you wish to cover the head, girls should wear a latex swimming cap.

BOYS SWIMMING KIT

Swimming trunks or shorts must be worn.
Boys cannot wear t-shirts.

If shorts are chosen they must be proper swimming shorts and not normal football/PE shorts. Shorts must be above the knee in length and have no buttons or zips on them. If they are too long, it will restrict movement and make learning to swim much more difficult.

No boy should be forced to swim topless and must be allowed to cover their upper torso and cover their hair.

I believe by forcing boys to swim topless or by dividing school sports team into skins versus shirts we creating the English Defence League/ Reform UK thug of tomorrow. You only have to look at the riots in Rotherham to see what atrocities we have inflicted on the white working class youth of today.

https://www.kingdavidliverpool.co.uk/Information/Uniform/

PE UNIFORM

The following are the only items which may be worn:

For all pupils:

Navy/Sky Blue Shorts
Navy/Sky Blue Skort (optional alternative to shorts for girls)
Navy/Sky Blue Polo Shirt – with badge (Straight for boys / Tapered for girls)
Navy/Sky Blue Hoodie (optional)
Navy/Sky Blue Football socks
Navy Blue fitness leggings (optional alternative to shorts/skort for girls)
Football boots (optional for girls)
Trainers (no Converse or pumps allowed)
Towel
Full swimming costume / trunks (briefs/jammers/long swimming trunks not leisure shorts – all should be fitted with no pockets)

No boy should be forced to swim in a skimpy pair of swimming trunks. We must have leggings, rash vests and hair covers regardless of gender.

Furthermore we must ban all so called "Voluntary" catholic academies and end the dreaded practice of Papal showers in our schools.

https://www.stphiliphowardglossop.srscmat.co.uk/information/dress-code-and-equipment/#1650982764984-8eef839e-ebac

P.E. KIT – The Essentials
Black or white approved Polo shirt with school crest.
Plain black PE shorts.
Trainers or plimsolls.
Black socks.
Optional approved sweatshirt with school crest.
P.E. Kit – Additional
A plain black track-suit where P.E. staff say it is appropriate for winter – no logos or designer outfits.
Ties, jumper with school crest and all items of P.E. kit can be purchased from school.

A current price list is included.

Physical Education is a National Curriculum subject and all students are required to participate in the course

All students are required to shower unless there is a confirmed medical reason for not doing so.

I am convinced we now need an islamic system of modesty in our school to end these myandrist practices and allow all pupils to wear tracksuits for both inside and outside sports, regardless of whether it is winter time.

It is haram to wear garments of fame and vanity, which means a garment that stands out from others so that people will look at the wearer and he will become known for it.

Ibn ‘Umar said: The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) said: “Whoever wears a garment of fame and vanity, Allah will dress him in a garment like it on the Day of Resurrection.”

According to another version, “…then set it ablaze.” And according to a third version, “will dress him in a garment of humiliation.” (Narrated by Abu Dawud, 4029; Ibn Majah, 3606 and 3607; classed as hasan by Shaykh al-Albani in Sahih al-Targhib, 2089)

The brother may also refer to the section on Dress in this website, where there is more information.

And Allah knows best.

IP Logged: *.**.171.185

Comment by: Steve on 13th August 2024 at 08:47

Thanks for your comments James

When I started, I was like all boys at the time, nervous, afraid, and open to any wind up around, especially boys with older brothers at the school who knew "everything" !

Within a few day, a classmate got a gym detention. We all did early morning (shirtless) runs, and had been warned along the lines of "behave or you get the cane" Rapidly rumours spread - ever boy gets caned in a gym detention, minimum 12 strokes, they have to strip naked for the workout and to be caned, they have to run in only shorts and so on.

Everyone including the boy being punished believed every word - naturally !!

IP Logged: **.***.206.7

Comment by: James C on 11th August 2024 at 11:57

Steve, My boarding school took pretty much the same approach but the duration of the morning run increased by 10 mins each year until you were 13 then you stepped up to a 5 mile run around the playing field. Our PE teachers also had us barechested outdoors for one double lesson a week up to 13 then it increased to two again irrespective of the weather. We also did cross-country. Remedial PE was always outdoors and always barechested it was a very regular feature after lessons finished. You could see it taking place from the dorm windows which for our house looked out over the fields. No cane or slipper you'd get a certain number of remedial sessions instead. Indoors PE was the same barechests until you left.

IP Logged: **.*.215.169

Comment by: Alan on 5th August 2024 at 02:39

Comment by: Mickey on 4th August 2024 at 22:41


Be careful for what you wish for. It is so very easy to say something like that )it often gets a cheap round of applause on Any Questions), but if you keep building you also have to supply infrastructure, which is something most local authorities forget to do, hence a paucity of doctor and dentist surgeries - and - yes schools. as well.

Overpopulation is the curse of this country, and you can't get a quart into a pint pot. Perhaps that is a subject that schools should get over to -pupils.

Not that long ago, high rise blocks of flats and overdevelopment were considered the future - look at the decaying mess we have round us today, especially in London and other big cities.

IP Logged: ***.**.3.191

Comment by: Mickey on 4th August 2024 at 22:41

Alan said
However you enjoy the countryside, enjoy it while you can, as the new government seems determined to cover the country in concrete

And not a moment too soon. Hopefully then people will have somewhere to live!

IP Logged: **.***.227.180

Comment by: Alan on 31st July 2024 at 04:15

Comment by: Mickey on 27th July 2024 at 08:23


"Craig. I've just got back from a morning run in the countryside. And I took your advice and tucked my shirt into my shorts. Not sure whether I'll do it again, though it wasn't unpleasant."

Craig, Ifit were me, I would only do what you are comfortable doing. As an adult you don't "have to" do anything at all that makes you feel uncomfortable. If only school students were given the same courtesy.

However you enjoy the countryside, enjoy it while you can, as the new government seems determined to cover the country in concrete, by the simple expedient of making the greenbelt the "greybelt"

IP Logged: ***.**.3.191

Comment by: Chris G on 28th July 2024 at 07:50

Mickey, Bernard et al
Out by the river yesterday afternoon, the usual crop of runners, almost all minus shirts.. A small minority of the males had "safety shirts" but I don't think any of the females did.

IP Logged: **.***.100.60

Comment by: Mickey on 27th July 2024 at 08:23

Craig. I've just got back from a morning run in the countryside. And I took your advice and tucked my shirt into my shorts. Not sure whether I'll do it again, though it wasn't unpleasant.

I still think having an outie (or, I suppose, being shy of it) is a valid excuse!

IP Logged: **.***.237.116

Comment by: Bernard on 22nd July 2024 at 22:36

Alan - in fact that was the first time I have ever posted a link to anything on this or any other site - it has taken a while to work out how to include a link. Still - you wouldn't want to let the truth stop you attacking another contributor!

IP Logged: **.***.73.24

Comment by: Steve on 22nd July 2024 at 07:51

I went to boarding school from aged 9 on, as my father works overseas - it was just as it was.

By the standards of the 1960's, it was "normal" in terms of discipline - yes boys got caned, but usually it was the slipper/plimsolls, or a punishment gym type session. Especially once you got to 13 or beyond, a caning was designed to hurt and leave clear marks for other boys to see (in showers/dorms) for several days after.

All boys did a morning run, all year around. At 9/10 it was a couple of laps of the playing fields (so 10 mins or less), and it moved upwards each year, so that by 13/14 you did a "proper" 3 or 4 mile run. Every boy had to strip to the waist, no matter how cold it was. We did indoor pe in only shorts, but that was common I think.

There was no regime of set times for the run, or boys being punished for being last, but you were expected to "do your best/not be slow/lazy", and cold showers or repeat runs were used. I also recall a boy being caned for wearing a rugby shirt one freezing morning - but that was more for stupidity really, as he kind of stood out with dozens of other skinny bare chested boys ! We had to wear "normal" pj's for bed, and looking back that made no sense, as inside it was top & bottom of your pj's, and outside it was thin shorts only.

IP Logged: *.**.251.59

Comment by: Alan on 22nd July 2024 at 04:14

Comment by: Bernard on 21st July 2024 at 21:08


We can always rely on you, Bernard, to trawl the internet looking for pictures of that sort.

IP Logged: ***.**.3.191

Comment by: Bernard on 21st July 2024 at 21:08

Alan - I knew I could rely on you for a negative comment! I linked the word "ideal" to the term "boy's gym kit" not academic subjects.
It can get very warm and humid in Hong Kong and there would not have been such luxuries as air conditioning in those days. My take on the clips would be that the school was taking its duty of care seriously. Boys who are comfortable are better able to concentrate on their studies.

IP Logged: **.***.73.24

Comment by: Alan on 21st July 2024 at 13:17

Bernard 17th July 2102

Can't quite see what Hong Kong 55 years ago (minimum) has to do with British schools. Nothing "ideal" about that mode of dress for academic subjects - except to a very strange minority.

IP Logged: ***.**.3.191

Comment by: Ian on 21st July 2024 at 13:07

Bernard, it is school holiday time so I think everyone is away.

Discovering an old pair of PE shorts in amongst those that I wear during warm weather, memories of the summer holiday in 1962 came back - the transition from primary to secondary in a Scottish grammar school.

Our class teacher during that year was given to warning us what to expect in secondary – a separate teacher for each subject (about a dozen in all) against four in primary (class teacher, drama, music and last, but not least, PE). The primary teachers had time to get to know us whereas the secondary teachers did not, so would quickly resort to punishment rather than persuasion. Just to emphasise this, he would often “just happen to bump into” his former pupils who seemed always to have been on the receiving end of six of the best, or a thousand lines. Sometimes whole classes were punished. Fortunately, his warnings turned out to be exaggerated.

Our PE teacher took the same approach. Primary PE was already quite hard and the teachers were noticeably stricter, being seen as a link to the military. As our bodies were growing, he said, we would have to work a lot harder. Also, there would be a more rigorous approach - “yes sir/no sir”, standing to attention and not slouching around, military style marching. And in the final PE period of the year, he dropped the absolute bombshell - “Next year, you're going to strip naked at the end of the period and take a shower”. Horror of horrors!

You can guess what the conversation came back to over the summer. Unlike the class teacher, the PE teacher's warnings were an understatement. Our class was assigned the new PE teacher – a young ex-Army PTI with “old fashioned methods”. A new broom to sweep clean.

The first few periods were OK and he even seemed sympathetic to our shyness about showers. Soon we had to queue naked and wait until we were told to shower. Even for showers after swimming where we initially were allowed to wear trunks. After a while, he trusted us well enough not to supervise us, although he seemed to have X-ray eyes to alert him to any boy not showering.

If you forgot your PE kit, you did it in your underpants. Forget your trunks and you went in naked. Not all the teachers did this. One day when we shared the pool with another class, I found myself naked with stinging hands whereas a boy in the other class had PE shorts on (not that they covered anything when wet).

Steve – we only did cross country once a week, but punishment runs were frequently awarded. In primary we always wore singlets outside, but secondary PE kit was shorts and gymshoes – nothing else. We quite liked it for athletics, but not for cross country or outside PE in winter.

IP Logged: **.**.57.89

Comment by: Chris G on 21st July 2024 at 10:48

Steve - I was at boarding school for my 6th form years in the early sixties. We didn't have early morning runs, just Rugby/Cricket as seasonally appropriate on Wednesday and Saturday afternoons. Quite often in the winter months the Rugby pitches would be waterlogged, and then we got cross-country or road runs instead. Dress code was always plimsolls, shorts and mandatory top. Bare-skin topless definitely taboo, both out-of-doors and in the gym, but universally acceptable in the dormitories.

IP Logged: **.***.9.166

Comment by: Steve on 21st July 2024 at 07:46

Does anyone have any memories of boarding school in the 60's and having to do an early morning run ever day ?

At my school we had a run 6 days/week, all weathers, distance depended on age. Shorts and plimsolls only naturally, so shirtless

IP Logged: *.**.251.59

Comment by: Bernard on 17th July 2024 at 21:02

Things seem to be rather quiet here at the moment. Here are some short clips which might be of interest. Going back to the 60s they show what might be called an ideal boy's gym kit being worn at other times during the school day.
https://www.gettyimages.co.uk/search/2/film?phrase=60s%20sea%20school%20hong%20kong

IP Logged: **.***.73.24

Comment by: Chris G on 6th July 2024 at 12:57

Michael, the great thing about English Country Dancing is that you only have to be able to count up to eight

IP Logged: **.***.12.24

Comment by: Michael on 6th July 2024 at 08:43

Back in the late 1950s and early 1960s, and possibly in an effort to preserve our traditional culture, there was an option to teach Country Dancing. This was a regular fixture on my primary school's timetable, and my class became quite adept at each dance's individual choreography. The jaunty music was new to all of us and, with the rapid, almost breathless activity, added up to a welcome change from our usual sedentary routine. Sadly, Country Dancing proved to be a short-lived 'fad' and was all too soon displaced by another topic in the ever-evolving curriculum.

IP Logged: **.**.28.250

Comment by: Matthew S on 27th June 2024 at 22:07

Alan and Chris G, thank you for your interesting recollections. I must admit never hearing of Honneger's "Pacific 231" previously, but will seek it out.

I was not a musical child, but various pieces of classical music were played immediately before our junior school assemblies and on one of these occasions I thrilled to hear a recording of the William Tell Overture. Perhaps I had not heard it before.

IP Logged: *.**.29.38

Comment by: Alan on 20th June 2024 at 16:35

Chris G - If you enjoy train music, there is a similar piece by the Brazilian composer, Villa-Lobos called "
The Little Train of Caipira". I think it is almost contemporary with Pacific 231, and V-L wrote it as a break from composing his many Bachianas Brasileiras. There were 10 in all,
I think. At one time BB5 was greatly admired by big bands, and I played flugelhorn on it. But only once!

IP Logged: ***.**.3.189

Comment by: Chris G on 20th June 2024 at 13:08

Pacific 231 has lonf been one of my favourite pieces, and although probably as monotonous as Bolero, somehow its less irritatingly monotonous.

The sunny weather here over the last few days has brought out a good crop of shirtless runners and cyclists, of both persuasions. Out of school hours, bare navels seem to be the adornment of choice of most young ladies - don't know why the boys don't have the same fashion opportunity

IP Logged: **.***.211.82

Comment by: Alan on 20th June 2024 at 05:26

At junior school, in our so-called "music lessons" where we were taught to play the triangle or tambourine, there was ONE cassette tape, and all it had on it was Ravel's Bolero coupled with Honneger's "Pacific 231", depicting a steam railway engine. I think Ravel was to encourage our triangling, the Honneger was an occasional "treat", if the teacher had had enough of Ravel, and the triangles and tambourines.

IP Logged: ***.**.3.189

Comment by: Chris G on 19th June 2024 at 13:38

The opening theme to the original detective drama series Van Der Valk is said to bring back memories of bygone "music and movement" classe.

IP Logged: **.***.211.82

Comment by: Matthew S on 18th June 2024 at 23:13

Perhaps this may raise a wry smile.

I never hear "Dance of the Sugar Plum Fairy", from the Nutcracker Suite by Tchaikovsky, without mentally transporting to my infant school PE in a high-windowed Victorian hall, dusty parquet flooring, skimpy shorts, goose-pimples and all. (This was relatively late: I left infant school in 1992).

May I ask visitors to this site: do other pieces of classical music, or other musical genres, evoke similar recollections?

IP Logged: *.**.131.46